| Thursday, July 3 2008 |
NVIDIA admits that some of its notebook graphics processors are failing at "higher than normal rates", in a filing with the Securities and Exchange Commission. These chip failures will cost NVIDIA anywhere between 150 and 200 million US Dollars this quarter financial year toward warranty, repair, return and replacement for laptops with such NVIDIA products incorporated.
Nvidia says that "significant quantities" of chips are experiencing thermal issues caused by possibly weak die and packaging - in essence the parts are overheating and failing, while not pointing out exactly which laptop models are affected by this. As an immediate response, NVIDIA prepared an emergency driver that maintains the fan cooling speed higher than original parameters. Expect the notebook to be noisier.
NVIDIA had announced yesterday that they were looking at a Q2 revenue falling more in the range of $875 million to $950 million contradicting analysts' speculation of a $1.1 billion figure. Repercussions soon followed at the Nasdaq, where the NVIDIA stock plunged 21.94 per cent or $3.95 to $14.08 a share.
Shareholders can get some respite from NVIDIA's recent press release which says that the company is seeking insurance to cover the costs incured with the issue of the failing notebook computer components. Says the press release:
Sources: TG Daily, NVIDIA
Nvidia says that "significant quantities" of chips are experiencing thermal issues caused by possibly weak die and packaging - in essence the parts are overheating and failing, while not pointing out exactly which laptop models are affected by this. As an immediate response, NVIDIA prepared an emergency driver that maintains the fan cooling speed higher than original parameters. Expect the notebook to be noisier.
NVIDIA had announced yesterday that they were looking at a Q2 revenue falling more in the range of $875 million to $950 million contradicting analysts' speculation of a $1.1 billion figure. Repercussions soon followed at the Nasdaq, where the NVIDIA stock plunged 21.94 per cent or $3.95 to $14.08 a share.
Shareholders can get some respite from NVIDIA's recent press release which says that the company is seeking insurance to cover the costs incured with the issue of the failing notebook computer components. Says the press release:
You can read the complete press release by NVIDIA here.
Separately, NVIDIA plans to take a one-time charge from $150 million to $200 million against cost of revenue for the second quarter to cover anticipated warranty, repair, return, replacement and other costs and expenses, arising from a weak die/packaging material set in certain versions of its previous generation GPU and MCP products used in notebook systems. Certain notebook configurations with GPUs and MCPs manufactured with a certain die/packaging material set are failing in the field at higher than normal rates. To date, abnormal failure rates with systems other than certain notebook systems have not been seen. NVIDIA has initiated discussions with its supply chain regarding this material set issue and the Company will also seek to access insurance coverage for this matter.
Sources: TG Daily, NVIDIA
User comments
WAIT
nVidia admits that it has discovered that some of the mobile GPUs it sold have a high failure rate.
That is very different from admitting to selling faulty GPUs.
nVidia admits that it has discovered that some of the mobile GPUs it sold have a high failure rate.
That is very different from admitting to selling faulty GPUs.
man i would hate to be the guy in charge of mobile gpus at nvidia! things just havnt been going their way lately.
Bad luck comes in threes...
by: lemonadesoda;867467true. so what are the other two?
Bad luck comes in threes...
ATI and Intel :)
by: xfire;867479:laugh: nice :laugh: :slap:
ATI and Intel :)
Mobile GPU unit :slap: -> Nvidia
Intel:laugh:
ATI rakes the money.
Intel:laugh:
ATI rakes the money.
by: xfire;867485yea, ATI is definately feeling :pimp: right now
Mobile GPU unit :slap: -> Nvidia
Intel:laugh:
ATI rakes the money.
something wrong with the stock in this news because haven't fall to 14,08:
http://quotes.nasdaq.com/asp/SummaryQuote.asp?selected=NVDA&symbol=NVDA
http://quotes.nasdaq.com/asp/SummaryQuote.asp?selected=NVDA&symbol=NVDA
News is right. Price dropped to $14 after NASDAQ closed (so called after-hours trading). Just look at the opening prices when NASDAQ comes back on line.
by: laszlo;867491yea i noticed that too. http://finance.google.com/finance?q=NASDAQ%3ANVDA
something wrong with the stock in this news because haven't fall to 14,08:
http://quotes.nasdaq.com/asp/SummaryQuote.asp?selected=NVDA&symbol=NVDA
right time to buy Nvidia and ATI shares.
Does this help?
look at AMD's
http://finance.yahoo.com/q?d=t&s=amd
http://finance.yahoo.com/q?d=t&s=amd
good call, i didnt see that. check out the 5 year chart for nvidia. the highest they reached was during the announcement of their targetting of intel for intergrated graphics chips in october 07. since then it has been a steady decline.
Ati's has gone down by 0.3(5.8-5.44) tho' not 14 like nvidia.
AMD's stock is falling even though they seem to have the upper hand:shadedshu
by: tigger69;867521nvidia didnt go down 14 points, it dropped to 14 points. and with ati's stock price hovering around 5 any drop is a significant one.
Ati's has gone down by 0.3(5.8-5.44) tho' not 14 like nvidia.
I don't get it. Why is it that whenever defective packaging is detected, the chip designer is blamed instead of the foundry (TSMC, UMC etc.)? The foundry is the one which actually builds the chips (and packaging) for the designer so I believe it should be the one at fault here. Somehow they always slip through the cracks and get away with it. They must have some really good lawyers and bullet-proof contracts.
Not really. This is the same as if you went to Wal Mart and bought a Vizio LCD TV that had a fault causing premature failure of the backlight. Vizio doesn't manufacture the light, they buy them from another manufacturer.
But when it fails, John Q. Public is upset with Wal-Mart and Vizio. The lawyers start putting together a class action lawsuit against these companies. You don't see them going after the smaller light manufacturer. (Go after the company with the deeper pockets)
But when it fails, John Q. Public is upset with Wal-Mart and Vizio. The lawyers start putting together a class action lawsuit against these companies. You don't see them going after the smaller light manufacturer. (Go after the company with the deeper pockets)
why wouldnt you be upset with nvidia if you were an investor. the blame falls on nvidia because they are responsible for selling the product.
It's not like nVidia is going to stop using TSMC. Not a whole lot of alternatives for them really. Unless they wanted to get their own fab. I hear AMD has one sitting around O.o
Seriously, how do you manage to nutkick yourself multiple times in such rapid succession?
Seriously, how do you manage to nutkick yourself multiple times in such rapid succession?
They will sack somebody expendable and then stock will increase. This happens all the time to other companies. And any, what goes up must come down!
They've been number one for so long they just got complacent and made mistakes. Also i think Ati have rubbed a magic lamp or something to get their prices so low.
They've been number one for so long they just got complacent and made mistakes. Also i think Ati have rubbed a magic lamp or something to get their prices so low.
by: lemonadesoda;867460There are laptops failing out there....with their GPUs / Integrated Graphics going kaput.
WAIT
nVidia admits that it has discovered that some of the mobile GPUs it sold have a high failure rate.
That is very different from admitting to selling faulty GPUs.
by: lemonadesoda;867460+1, the title makes it sound like they knew the GPU's were faulty before they shipped them. They didn't, they just had a bad batch that have higher than normal failure rates. It sucks, but it happens, and has happened to every CPU and GPU company to date.
WAIT
nVidia admits that it has discovered that some of the mobile GPUs it sold have a high failure rate.
That is very different from admitting to selling faulty GPUs.
At least they are admitting to the problem, and are willing to fix it, and provide a solution to fix the problem.
The title TG Daily (source) used:
"Nvidia's stock bloodbath - company admits faulty chips, shares plunge 22% "
Seems like they're making a bigger deal. But hey, there is something going wrong, else the stock won't crash 22%.
As for the Admits to selling part, yes, they sold faulty parts, else they wouldn't have launched a driver to jack up fan speeds.
This is something by the nature of the "Sony Faulty Laptop battery" fiasco.
"Nvidia's stock bloodbath - company admits faulty chips, shares plunge 22% "
Seems like they're making a bigger deal. But hey, there is something going wrong, else the stock won't crash 22%.
As for the Admits to selling part, yes, they sold faulty parts, else they wouldn't have launched a driver to jack up fan speeds.
This is something by the nature of the "Sony Faulty Laptop battery" fiasco.
by: Easy Rhino;867516Everything has been on a steady decline, that is just the way it is right now. The economy sucks, and it is reflected in the stock market.
good call, i didnt see that. check out the 5 year chart for nvidia. the highest they reached was during the announcement of their targetting of intel for intergrated graphics chips in october 07. since then it has been a steady decline.
by: btarunr;867619It is down roughly 27% now. Though that isn't really a big deal, things like that happen when a company anounces bad news. The prices will rebound, because when some people pull out because the company is doing bad, others take the opertunity to buy in at the low prices, which will drive the price back up.
The title TG Daily (source) used:
"Nvidia's stock bloodbath - company admits faulty chips, shares plunge 22% "
Seems like they're making a bigger deal. But hey, there is something going wrong, else the stock won't crash 22%.
As for the Admits to selling part, yes, they sold faulty parts, else they wouldn't have launched a driver to jack up fan speeds.
This is something by the nature of the "Sony Faulty Laptop battery" fiasco.
by: btarunr;867607Lol not my one and thats all that matters better not put the mockers on it :p
There are laptops failing out there....with their GPUs / Integrated Graphics going kaput.
by: newtekie1;867620After it is known that the company could spend anywhere between $150~200 million on damage control? That's a whole lot of money, and can depreciate the share value. Investors make note of that. It's not just another bad news.
It is down roughly 27% now. Though that isn't really a big deal, things like that happen when a company anounces bad news. The prices will rebound, because when some people pull out because the company is doing bad, others take the opertunity to buy in at the low prices, which will drive the price back up.
by: newtekie1;867620+1
It is down roughly 27% now. Though that isn't really a big deal, things like that happen when a company anounces bad news. The prices will rebound, because when some people pull out because the company is doing bad, others take the opertunity to buy in at the low prices, which will drive the price back up.
LOL... the first thing i thought when i read the headline was "good time to buy nvidia." They've got alot going for them in the CUDA/ "we're gonna open a can of whoopass" department.
Share value depreciates with this news, but there is always an over-reaction. With good news the stock shoots up and then falls back to earth a bit later, and with bad news the stock goues through the ground, until people realize how undervalued it is.
by: btarunr;867628I know, it is definitely the reason for the sell off, but they should recover pretty quickly. With the current economy it might take a little longer, but they should still recover, that is how things like this work.
After it is known that the company could spend anywhere between $150~200 million on damage control? That's a whole lot of money, and can depreciate the share value. Investors make note of that. It's not just another bad news.
Whew. Luckily my laptop uses ATI integrated graphics. :)
Currently, it seems that both Nvidia and ATI are more concerned with low fan noise instead of a cool GPU. I really do not like this. I prefer to keep my expensive video card (or laptop) at a safe temperature, even if that means I can actually hear the fan running. According to the reviews I have been reading, the current ATI cards can idle near 70-80 celcius... and hit 100 on load!! :twitch: Those temperatures are not ideal for me... infact, they scare me. I wish they would try to keep the GPU in the 50 idle/70 load range and adjust the fan based on that. :(
I have a hunch that they would not have as many video cards fail if they just kept them running a touch cooler. That in turn would save them a lot of money and integrity. Hint, hint. ;)
Currently, it seems that both Nvidia and ATI are more concerned with low fan noise instead of a cool GPU. I really do not like this. I prefer to keep my expensive video card (or laptop) at a safe temperature, even if that means I can actually hear the fan running. According to the reviews I have been reading, the current ATI cards can idle near 70-80 celcius... and hit 100 on load!! :twitch: Those temperatures are not ideal for me... infact, they scare me. I wish they would try to keep the GPU in the 50 idle/70 load range and adjust the fan based on that. :(
I have a hunch that they would not have as many video cards fail if they just kept them running a touch cooler. That in turn would save them a lot of money and integrity. Hint, hint. ;)
by: newtekie1;867620true, but not all stocks reflect the market.
Everything has been on a steady decline, that is just the way it is right now. The economy sucks, and it is reflected in the stock market.
Anyone have a link to the emergency drivers? Just curious if it makes a difference.
Some classic examples:
The batteries Sony used to make for laptops. Remember the costs Sony had to shell out? What next? Some OEMs maintained an arm's distance with Sony and its batteries, brand value was lost.
With so many alternatives to NVIDIA in terms of system chipset and integrated/discrete graphics with both Intel and AMD processor platform, do you think this problem is just something which those $150-200M could pull NV out of? I'm not jumping to a conclusion but just telling, that the brand value of NV in affordable solutions for notebooks has definitely taken a beating today.
Another example specific to India...though I won't be surprised if it turns out to be global:
Back when AMD made hay with its then successful K8, Opteron became a great brand for server/WS processors, they sold cheaper and performed better than those Netburst laden Xeons. Even after Xeon was blessed with the Core Architecture, Opteron somehow maintained its brand value and kept ticking in the market. Come Barcelona, IT managers were all raved about it...come TLB erratum, AMD Epic Fail in the market here. Today, despite the TLB fix, nobody here with >two neurons between the ears chooses Opteron when planning for big setups.
The batteries Sony used to make for laptops. Remember the costs Sony had to shell out? What next? Some OEMs maintained an arm's distance with Sony and its batteries, brand value was lost.
With so many alternatives to NVIDIA in terms of system chipset and integrated/discrete graphics with both Intel and AMD processor platform, do you think this problem is just something which those $150-200M could pull NV out of? I'm not jumping to a conclusion but just telling, that the brand value of NV in affordable solutions for notebooks has definitely taken a beating today.
Another example specific to India...though I won't be surprised if it turns out to be global:
Back when AMD made hay with its then successful K8, Opteron became a great brand for server/WS processors, they sold cheaper and performed better than those Netburst laden Xeons. Even after Xeon was blessed with the Core Architecture, Opteron somehow maintained its brand value and kept ticking in the market. Come Barcelona, IT managers were all raved about it...come TLB erratum, AMD Epic Fail in the market here. Today, despite the TLB fix, nobody here with >two neurons between the ears chooses Opteron when planning for big setups.
Poor Nvidia... another reason why I switched over to my 4850.
hmmm im not really worried since my 8800M GTS card idles and loads at a lower temp than my 8800GT in my desktop
This information would be a lot more useful if they said what chips this affects. Now I'm just going to think my laptop is going to explode at any moment :laugh:
Lol yeah got me abit worried cmon lets see a list :p
Oh god, my last lappy has a NV chip...HIT THE DECK :p
Yeah, we really need a list of chips soon. I don't use the thing that much & it really hasn't gave me any problems but I would still like to know whether its safe or not.
Yeah, we really need a list of chips soon. I don't use the thing that much & it really hasn't gave me any problems but I would still like to know whether its safe or not.
Good thing mine has X1250.. This is not good nvidia. I hope this doesent set them back too much. But then again this is really good for AMD :laugh:
ahaahahahahhahahh
I think the title is a little one sided. . .
At least Nvidia is doing something about it and willing to admit there are problems with these GPUs.
btarunr, you do have a point about OEMs being more cautious now about Nvidias Integrated GPUs but I think if Nvidia does a good job taking care of this they won't have a problem recovering.
Good news is its a good time to buy Nvidia stock ; )
Thanks for the link. Funny it shows Nvidia down, Intel down, AMD down, but for some stupid reason MS is up . . .
At least Nvidia is doing something about it and willing to admit there are problems with these GPUs.
btarunr, you do have a point about OEMs being more cautious now about Nvidias Integrated GPUs but I think if Nvidia does a good job taking care of this they won't have a problem recovering.
Good news is its a good time to buy Nvidia stock ; )
by: Easy Rhino;867496
yea i noticed that too. http://finance.google.com/finance?q=NASDAQ%3ANVDA
Thanks for the link. Funny it shows Nvidia down, Intel down, AMD down, but for some stupid reason MS is up . . .
Nvidia are getting the limelight for the WRONG reasons, these few weeks...
Why should microsoft be down? They are doin pretty good. Vista is starting to sell more because they are really working on fixing everything.
I would wait on that stock. My advisor said it looked like it will fall some more for the next 2 weeks. They need to annouce a new project quick :(
by: Darkrealms;867758Yes, I agree with that.
btarunr, you do have a point about OEMs being more cautious now about Nvidias Integrated GPUs but I think if Nvidia does a good job taking care of this they won't have a problem recovering.
by: ShadowFold;867761
Why should microsoft be down? They are doin pretty good. Vista is starting to sell more because they are really working on fixing everything.
I didn't say they should be down. I just saying there was irony in it. (I'm always a little negative on MS, they've had a lot of bad practices)
hey look NV is down to $12.70 this is the loewst there stock has been in years
and for those looking at AMD its just a little down todays its been going up since the HD4K release
and for those looking at AMD its just a little down todays its been going up since the HD4K release
man, since ati released the 4850, nothing has been going right for nvidia, their drivers got hacked, they're graphics cards are getting dominated by 3 cards from the looks and now, their notebook gpu's are failing
kinda feel bad for em
kinda feel bad for em
by: cdawall;867797God, another 2 buck :eek: My advisor never been wrong but he just gave me another call & told me to wait a month :shadedshu I'm ready to dump 2-3 grand in them, now :cry:
hey look NV is down to $12.70 this is the loewst there stock has been in years
and for those looking at AMD its just a little down todays its been going up since the HD4K release
You gotta read this: http://www.dailytech.com/NVIDIA+Posts+Weaker+Earnings+to+Defective+GPUs+Warns+of+Lower+Sales/article12268c.htm
by: DailyTechRecall = they already sold faulty parts.
That was not the end of the bad news from NVIDIA either. It announced that it was facing a massive recall, due to overheating GPUs in notebook computers. NVIDIA reported higher than average failures in both the laptop GPUs and in laptop chipsets.
by: btarunr;867835I think I'm going to be sick :cry:
You gotta read this: http://www.dailytech.com/NVIDIA+Posts+Weaker+Earnings+to+Defective+GPUs+Warns+of+Lower+Sales/article12268c.htm
Maybe I should wait until the Q3 is over. This whole quarter looks like fools' gold to NV.
by: cdawall;867797Yep, a good time to buy for people wanting to stick it out for a while and wait for the stocks to go back up. I just wish I got in on the stock back in 2004 when their prices were below $3.15. $12.70 is down a lot from what it was at yesterday, but when you look at it, it is still way up from where it was at a few years ago.
hey look NV is down to $12.70 this is the loewst there stock has been in years
by: newtekie1;867926i think now is the time to buy AMD stock if anything NV stock will probably keep falling until novemeber or so (just my prediction)
Yep, a good time to buy for people wanting to stick it out for a while and wait for the stocks to go back up. I just wish I got in on the stock back in 2004 when their prices were below $3.15. $12.70 is down a lot from what it was at yesterday, but when you look at it, it is still way up from where it was at a few years ago.
by: newtekie1;867926If you're a NV shareholder, you are in a win-win situation. I made the final edit to the OP, NV announces that it's seeking insurance to cover that upto $200M that it could incur.
Yep, a good time to buy for people wanting to stick it out for a while and wait for the stocks to go back up. I just wish I got in on the stock back in 2004 when their prices were below $3.15. $12.70 is down a lot from what it was at yesterday, but when you look at it, it is still way up from where it was at a few years ago.
by: cdawall;867932I would avoid both as any type of investment. Either one is going to have an extremely tough time making it through the next couple of years. Your going to see a lot of tech failures, mergers, buyouts etc. One of these companies will go bankrupt. If anything they would make a good short.
i think now is the time to buy AMD stock if anything NV stock will probably keep falling until novemeber or so (just my prediction)
by: lemnad;868010after tha AMD/ATi merger i doubt AMD will be the one getting swept under the mat there is to much they can do now even if they became a company similar to Via they would survive. Nvidia doesn't have the background AMD/ATi does to fall back on.
I would avoid both as any type of investment. Either one is going to have an extremely tough time making it through the next couple of years. Your going to see a lot of tech failures, mergers, buyouts etc. One of these companies will go bankrupt. If anything they would make a good short.
Hey Btarunr~
Any link to those drivers? Nvidia.com still shows January's 167 drivers. I'm interested since I just put a second nvidia card in my laptop.
Any link to those drivers? Nvidia.com still shows January's 167 drivers. I'm interested since I just put a second nvidia card in my laptop.
by: Megasty;867824do it yourself.
God, another 2 buck :eek: My advisor never been wrong but he just gave me another call & told me to wait a month :shadedshu I'm ready to dump 2-3 grand in them, now :cry:
I'd be really wary of buying into those Nvidia stocks. Tech has been sitting high and mighty over the slowing economy. A pop like that is gonna send all the shareholders in a frenzy. In reality, they only have so much product on the market anyway. A spike in new investors will just allow to old investors to back out with less of a loss, causing even more loss for new guys. Mmm... I'd say if it hits 8$/share then get into it. By the look of things, they've been overinflated, and need to settle quite a bit lower.
by: Silverel;868139Wow Free tech reviews and stock analysis :laugh:
I'd be really wary of buying into those Nvidia stocks. Tech has been sitting high and mighty over the slowing economy. A pop like that is gonna send all the shareholders in a frenzy. In reality, they only have so much product on the market anyway. A spike in new investors will just allow to old investors to back out with less of a loss, causing even more loss for new guys. Mmm... I'd say if it hits 8$/share then get into it. By the look of things, they've been overinflated, and need to settle quite a bit lower.
Thanks for the heads up.
so this includes integrated graphics as well? My wifes laptop has an integrated nvidia gpu (like 6100g or something.) I sure hope that doesnt fail because that will suck.
by: Easy Rhino;868067Nah, over the last 8 yrs he has made me over 210 grand. I bought him a car for our 5 yr annv. :D If he say wait, I say how long. The stock market isn't written in stone but if he say the NV stock will steadily drop for another month, I believe him - but I still want to cash in while the in-ing is good :(
do it yourself.
by: cdawall;868026I agree.
after tha AMD/ATi merger i doubt AMD will be the one getting swept under the mat there is to much they can do now even if they became a company similar to Via they would survive. Nvidia doesn't have the background AMD/ATi does to fall back on.
Even though AMD's stock hasn't started to climb again, they've been fairly stable over the last few months - it will take some time for AMD to start showing any real gains again . . .
but, they're back on the right track as well - if AMD itself scores a hit with a new CPU offering by the end of the year, they'll defi be in great shape. It's kinda iffy right now on the CPU lineups, they're run into a lot of bad luck with the Phenoms, but I'm certain they've got something in the works aside from Fuzion.
all i care about is WHICH gpus are effected.. i have a brand new ..fairly expensive lappie with a 8800m gts 512 in it...i want to know if its going to munch itself and where i can get it replaced. .haha
by: cdawall;868026I agree too. They are offering lower cost parts that offer comparable performance to that of Intel and Nvidia. Other than some stuff already in the pipeline I think these will be last high end consumer graphics cards we see for a while. The market for $300+ cards is going to all but evaporate as the economy disintegrates. I would say no one will thrive, but it is who can survive. Nvidia seems to be in a good position to fold first.
after tha AMD/ATi merger i doubt AMD will be the one getting swept under the mat there is to much they can do now even if they became a company similar to Via they would survive. Nvidia doesn't have the background AMD/ATi does to fall back on.
